Interesting...thanks for the info. Now here's a question for you, which is better? The Hyster Fortis (or Yale Vericator) or the Toyota 8-Series? Don't Toyota parts cost a lot more than Hyster/Yale parts? Isn't that SAS full of expensive parts?
I don't know much about Toyota...sorry for possibly annoying questions.

As far as the SAS on the 8-series is concerned there have been minor changes to the system. The rest of the truck is even more impressive, again minor changes that add up to a much improved truck. The thing that most impresses me the most is the simplicity of the thought behind the truck. One engine and one transmission choice for the last 22 years. NACCO has 3 engines and 3 or 4 transmissions (9-12 combinations).

Market is getting closer if I remember the numbers Toyota is at 19%, Raymond 7%. Yale was 14% and Hyster was 11%.

Worldwide Toyota is about 5B and NACCO is about 1.5-2B.

Let me throw a question out there since I just caught onto this discussion thread. As we know, NACCO is Hyster and Yale with NACCO holding about 28% of the market share (Toyota closing in fast with 26%). Does anyone know volume share between Hyster & Yale units. I am mainly looking for volumes produced in 2006 for class 4 & 5 IC trucks. Curious to know volume differances. ITA does not break it down.

"Dropping Shorts" Interesting comment coming from a Toyota guy. Around here, that's the selling point of a Toyota truck, see how low the salesman will go. (Kidding-no bashing intended towards you-just observation of demographic area)

BTW, what can you tell me about the SAS system as a whole & the new 8-Series machines? I hear they're pretty impressive.

I worked for Yale for seven years and had been associated with Yale for the previous twenty years and now I work for Toyota.

THE YALE AND HYSTER ARE THE SAME TRUCK. I HAVE BOTH THEIR PRICE PAGES. THEY ARE THE SAME TRUCK.

DEALERS DO MAKE A DIFFERENCE, BUT YALE AND HYSTER ARE STILL THE SAME TRUCK PRODUCED IN THE SAME PLANTS WITH THE SAME OPTIONS AND NOW MANDATED SAME STANDARD DISCOUNTING AND SAME SPECIAL DISCOUNTING FOR BIG DEALS.

BUT THEY ARE STILL THE SAME TRUCK. IT STILL COMES DOWN TO WHO WANTS TO DROP THEIR SHORTS THE FURTHEST.

Just got back from Grand Rapids Michigan, visited Haworth plant and saw many Crowns running about there. Yale must be having tough time penetrating the account here.

Back here in Malaysia, both Hyster & Yale has been slow for the past 4-5 years. Both dealer are either saddle with manpower or financial issues.

Otherwise, i do believe those two brands are very good products and offer minimal maintenance.

yes thats all fine and dandy

but has man really walked on the moon ?

and who's peter frampton ?....has he walked on the moon ?

and whats this monytrol thing......is that a hyster bank ?

i cant think anymore.......i need some tea......happy easter

No differences in a Yale or Hyster! Even your Monotrol. It can and is ordered on Yale's. We deliver them every day. Only difference on a Yale or a Hyster is the Decal. As far as service? That depends on where your located and who you are using for service? I seen both on both sides of the fence. Service is only as good as your techs are and how good the dealer is stocked with the right inventory? The rest is HISTORY. ETS

Tom_H,

What side of the state are you located at? I have to agree with you about Hyster service in Michigan. NACCO should have done there homework better in Michigan and picked a better dealership to repersent the Hyster name.

Here in Michigan Yale is King! Hyster has fallen hard over the years here in Michigan.And its not getting any better.We look at Hyster now as the "Hillbilly waaaanabee's"TCM dealer turned Hyster??? What a joke.
It all comes down to dealership service. Thats a fact JACK!

NACCO is following in the same foot steps as MCFA - When Hyster was brougn und er the same NACO umbrella as Yale - intially ther was some visible product differentiation. Today the difference are the number of letter's in the name and teh shade of yellow - price book offering maybe different but it would doubt that those options one has published is available on a special quote basis for the other guy. At least NACCO stil has separate marketing groups & management directors.

Scott S (as in Swakow) - TUSK stand for Trucks Unsaleable By Komatsu or jsut a name change for the red Kalmar AC. I'm told one of the key persons who luved the name is no longer with Komatsu. Yes Scott I did work at KFI.

I don't buy it. Hyster dealers have been lazy, expecting their customers to roll over and buy a Hyster just because of the brand name. Yale dealers actively go after the Toyota's and Cat's of the world.

Fortis comes out, it's a truck that is priced higher than the old XM series, you have to sell value. Hyster dealers were not ready to aggressively sell and demo the truck and as a result lost share. If you sell the Fortis to the old Hyster customers (who never had a problem with the older XMs), you really have to have your act together because the Fortis costs more than the XM.

And General Motors took very few trucks in 2005 and 2006 leading to lower share for Hyster.

Yes, Yale does have a higher market share than Hyster but only because of NACCO. Hyster's market share has plummeted since the trucks have been synergized. This was not the case before NACCO purchased Hyster. Yale's market share has increased at the expense of Hyster. When I left the Hyster dealership in 2004, Hyster had about an 18% share. I hear that it is now single digit. NACCO gave Yale the keys to the store. What a shame.

The trucks are almost identical. The decision point for the customer is (and should be regardless of which brands are being considered) which offers the best package that meet that customers specific needs. Product availability, service capability, parts availability, rental fleet (not just size, but do they have trucks with the specs needed) financial strengtrh, reputation in the local market, brand reputation on a national basis (especially important for multi locationed companies). Finally what other value added services do they offer that will help the productivity and over all cost of ownership of the lift truck. In todays industry, there are very few manufaturers that do not make a good truck. Some offer features that others don't but overall the products are good. That is the price the OEM's pay to sit in the game and battle for matrket share (it may be of interest that Yale has had a higher share than Hyster for many years now) The rest of the equation is the dealer nertwork and the other items I mentioned earlier. These are machines and eventually the need maintenance. Who can offer the package that keeps the trucks productive the highest percentage of the time and therfore gives the lowest cost of wonership should be the brand you select. The answer to that quetion may differ depending on which part of the country you are in. If you are a large account and are looking for a supplier that can deliver consistant performance regardless of location then I would look at the various OEM fleet management programs and determine whose fits your needs the best.

Tusk = 1970's album from Fleetwood Mac.
Someone was a big fan, I guess.

I hear the next brand of forklift will be named after a Peter Frampton album......

WHo can explain an OEM action...?

It is not just Yale/Hyster. What about Cat/Mitsi and Komatsu/Tusk? Being familiar with Komatsu/Tusk (Tusk? who picked that) I am surprised that the major dealers of Tusk are factory owned stores and are just killing the Komatsu dealers with overlapping territories. Why would Komatsu want to promote the Tusk line over there name brand?

I worked for a Hyster dealer for 12 years before leaving in 2004. I assure you that they are the same trucks. That is exactly why I left the Hyster dealership. Yale dealers began to call on all of the Hyster customers and would gladly quote the trucks at or near cost. The long time Hyster customers would then ask me why there was such a difference in price between the Hyster and the Yale if they were indeed the same truck. They would also ask me to differentiate my truck from theirs so that they could justify buying from me. There is basically no difference and I would not lie to a customer. If you then told the customer that your dealership was better, they would point out that they could buy the Yale and have it serviced by the Hyster dealer. Not many dealerships will turn down service just to protect their sales reps. NACCO has seriously impacted the profitability of their dealers. They have destroyed what was once a very good Hyster Company while trying to build up the Yale brand. Most of Hyster's competitors empathize with the Hyster dealers and have nothing but disdain for the Yale dealers. One of my friends who owns a Hyster dealership was speaking about the new Fortis line. He said to me "even if it turns out to be the greatest truck in the world, what will it matter to my dealership with Yale having the exact same truck and willing to sell it so cheap?"

for the majority of models the only difference is paint and stickers

they run down the same assy like for god sakes

the same engineers design both trucks

the only difference is Sales and Advertizing and lately they run pretty close..

HUH?
If there is a fit and finish difference between Hyster and Yale, why are there Nacco part numbers on all the components in the truck? If there is a difference, why are trucks with no logos on them running around the Portland CBDC? Besides, your own post indicates you agree there isn't a difference because you can order parts between the two brands...and then go on to say there is a difference (???)


The VX/Fortis product is identical as will all products from now on. Maybe in the past there were differences between battery covers, etc but for the person who's asking the question in this post (who is presumably comparing the purchase of a new Yale vs Hyster)....THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE (except a decal and a shade of yellow).

Monotrol isn't Hyster only; also been available in Yale for at least 10 years...called FDC...foot-directional-control....