Theres no way you can start to consider overall cost of ownership on a brand new product. Every company has their first few attempts, and usually has to fail first before they can suceede in the end. Remember the first set of Crown RR5000. I've Seen customers demand that the factory come and pick them up because they had absolutely no endurance, and the costs were through the roof. But now, after a few years of improvements, the new RR5700 Series is a sweet ride. I just hope Crown's able to keep up with actual customer demands, and not just what their management thinks the customers need.

And Edward, I loved that comment about only seeing the Broken Forklifts...Lol.

Boy it really sounds like someone is Crown Brainwashed there!! you will have a hard time penetrating the market of the IC equipment when you are $8,000 - $10,000 more then other IC manufacturers. So you are aware Toyota is made in (not just assembled in) Columbus Indiana. In case you have not heard Toyota makes cars as well and they have more US content then GM and Ford.
One last thing in case you didn't hear this yet....the John Deere Plant just placed it's order with Toyota forklifts. :) believe it or not- check it out! what does that tell you??

For Hank, wow it seems like you are not too fond of Crown. Must be from one of the dealerships in Florida that Crown pulled. Give it a little time for this new unit to get out there and then you will see why customers will leave their current IC truck provider and switch to the C5. If you have been in this business for a while you should know by now that Crown eventually ends up dominating in all areas of this business. As for Toyota, Raymond and the other IC products...Crown is american made! We keep jobs here! Ever try buying a part for a Toyota/Nissan IC truck that needs to come from Japan? The prices are rediculous! Lets talk lowest cost of ownership sometime.

Fair enough, Sounds like you've got some experience on trucks too bad you aren't in our neck of the woods. There's no doubt only time will tell on the C-5. We're all just trying to make a better mouse trap.

OK Tony, your right, it is a percent of sales increase... and not really market share.
[I ain't no fan of Toyota/Raymond either, in fact, the only good forklift is one I never seen, since I only get to see the broken ones]


:-)

Edward your math may be correct but it has nothing to do with market share.

Let Raymond figure out Class 1 before they try their hands at an IC truck.

but now crown can say they have increased their I/C market share by +100%, for months on end.... even if it means delivering 2 trucks this month and 4 trucks next month...

Especially compared to Crown??? Great observation Edward, considering the truck was just released. I would imagine every I.C. manufacturer has a better market share as of today. Everyone in the business is well aware Toyota is dominating the I.C. market here in the US. Crown just decided to get a piece of the pie.

the name of the "Raymond" I/C truck is spelled "Toyota", and I hear they already have (especially compared to Crown) a considerable I/C market share....

;-)

Who knows....maybe Raymond will take a crack at the IC market too.

The goal will be to expand to 8 and 10,000 lb trucks next, but with a down economy, they are going to have to sell a few of the 5 and 6,000 trucks first...I wouldn't be suprised if the 8/10s are out within 3 years.... Hamech will always stay so Crown can compete against the "low cost trucks"

Linde are still in front on the design side along with junghienrich who's new hydrostatic trucks
are now beating Linde in Europe. They use same VW engine but different transmissions that are similar. Torque transmissions with brakes are now years behind hydrostatic trucks. It will be interesting if Crown now look to develop a range of other ic trucks in the past they have used Daewoo in this range and komatsu for Hamach.

Daryl i,
"the last time we were told clarks were great was the introduction of the new cmp which was a tcm tailift samuk"
I am affraid your above statement is completely wrong.
The Clark CMP has nothing in common with tcm tailift and samuk. The CMP is the old Samsung product which used mainly Clark major components, ie transmission, mast and steer axle. The gas machines use Mitsi and the others all use Nissan. The diesel has always used Yanmar the others used Isuzu untill recently changing to Yanmar(except TCM I think)The CMP is still being built in Korea(the others being built in Taiwan and China) but is being super seeded by the CQ. Clark also build the GEN2 range which is a very well built and basic machine.

Just today I've seen in person, and heard running the new Crown C-5. I understand the skepticism of a company whose name is only big in narrow isle electric trucks, and that's only natural. But plain and simple, this looks and sounds like a pretty sweet ride. Also, I've worked on lots of Cats, A/C, Daewoo, and Clark gas trucks. Everything on the C-5 is the most maintence-friendly that I've ever seen. Change the water pump without dropping the counterweight....and the O2 sensor comes out in 45 seconds. I almost hope they break down so I get to turn a wrench on it some time soon :-)

Why you say Crown is not going to compete in the I/C market. First of all, the majority of the Crown dealers have handled and supported I/C units from Komatsu & Daewoo (maybe others) for many years I would suspect they are capable. This model range is strictly 4-6K cushion units that are used primarily indoors and that's were Crown main line plays well. Having a Crown made & labeled product will give them some added advantages in their primary market place.

Further they will get a lot of mileage out of "paid for demos" through their rental fleet exposures.

Crown needs to stay in narrow aisle where they belong. There is not any way Crown is going to compete in the IC market with suppliers such as Toyota, Lindi, or Nissan. They will see that they are not in Crown World anymore. The IC market is a street fight and the Yuppies from Crown will find themselves somewhere they do not want to be.

I think that if you were to look at this truck objectively, that is to say, change the decals from Crown to Whatever forklift, the glowing remarks wouldn't be so glowing.
What's the big deal about all of the power on a cushion tire truck that is used only indoors in relatively confined spaces?

I have not seen the new Crown IC unit myslf but have heard that there have been some cooling issues due to the vacuuming effect on this truck being too much. Has anyone had any experience with these to see this?
Thanks

in reply to Vic's question as to why crown should try and go I/C? I would bet it was "customer driven".
Crown has never seemed to me to be a "speculation driven" company. they had firm orders for the "wave" before it went to design, and I am willing to bet they had a locked in customer (?Lowes home improvement stores?) before the I/c conversations ever got to the design phase.