Ads
News service and business centre for materials handlingHOME
DISCUSSION FORUMS : Forkliftaction.communicate
NACCO Product Change
NACCO is dropping the Mazda and GM engines in their Class IV and V heart of the line product. Share is flat so I guess they need to drive profit in other areas.
  • Posted 10 Dec 2014 06:35 AM
Reply Report
Total replies: 32. Showing items 1 - 20 of 32 results.
12
Replies
  • wanderer
  • west midlands, United Kingdom
Hi Malc, what have you found out? Will it be all Kubota?
  • Posted 11 Dec 2014 08:14 PM
Reply Report
Mazda and GM are discontinuing these engine lines, so a change is necessary.
  • Posted 12 Dec 2014 03:20 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
The new engines will be from PSI. Trying to get more information myself, but it sounds like they're already in production with them.
  • Posted 16 Jan 2015 03:52 AM
Reply Report
  • edward_t
  • South Carolina, United States
in the past, I have seen sticker for PSI, who was whom had made the emission systems, not complete motors.
"it's not rocket surgery"
  • Posted 16 Jan 2015 05:47 AM
Reply Report
PSI had been doing the 3.0 and 4.3 GM engines for them for a while and GFI engine division, which is now owned by Impco, doing the 2.4 GM. So it does not surprise me that they would let PSI do the Kubota engines as well. Basically PSI dresses the engines to that OEM's spec. mostly the fuel system.
If memory serves me right it is who ever holds the EPA certification.
  • Posted 16 Jan 2015 06:52 AM
  • • Modified 16 Jan 2015 08:16 AM by poster
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
Here's a link to PSIs industrial engine line-up:
[url][url removed][/url]

I'm trying to figure out what the 2.0L/2.4L engines are based off. I don't recognize them. Definitely not the GM/Vortec 4 cyl engine though.

Gonna miss those Mazdas. They've served me very well. I've probably put a million hrs on the ones in my fleet and had one single major failure... after it was run out of oil.
  • Posted 16 Jan 2015 09:37 AM
  • • Modified 16 Jan 2015 09:38 AM by poster
Reply Report
Beeker,

The are Kubota engines. If you go to Hyster USA website you can click on the different models and it tells you which engine is used in which truck.
  • Posted 16 Jan 2015 11:26 PM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
I might be missing it, but the only reference I see to Kubota engines is the 2.5L optional engine on the 4000-7000 lb trucks.

I did just receive some addition information from Yale. Still nothing stating what the base engine is, but this might help:
4-cylinder single overhead cam design with 4 valves per cylinder
Cast iron engine block with a five main-bearing design for added strength
Aluminum cylinder head

I don't find anything matching this in Kubota's engine line-up.
  • Posted 17 Jan 2015 12:11 AM
  • • Modified 17 Jan 2015 12:20 AM by poster
Reply Report
I heard 4G64 Mitsubishi
  • Posted 19 Jan 2015 08:23 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
That's currently my best guess as well. But that just comes from seeing visual similarities, and knowing there is a 16V SOHC Mitsu engine in those displacements. Nothing concrete.
  • Posted 20 Jan 2015 01:19 AM
Reply Report
Regardless of manufacturer, an overhead cam on an aluminum head is destined to be high maintenance with a relatively short lifespan compared to a conventional in block camshaft system.
Yotamaster
  • Posted 23 Jan 2015 02:23 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
Given that I have regularly put over 20000 hrs on my Mazda OHC industrial engines, I'd argue otherwise. I've got about 20 still in service that way. Two units with over 40K.

Sure, we get timing belts break, but those are easy fixes on the non-interference engine.

Only head issues I get are the occasional head gasket failure, and tar build-up on the valves. You can also run them out of oil and seize that cam.

That being said, the 16V head configuration on the new engine definitely has me a little concerned. Plus a balance shaft. No word on whether or not they are interference engines, but they show 4000 hr timing belt change interval.
  • Posted 23 Jan 2015 07:26 AM
Reply Report
  • edward_t
  • South Carolina, United States
This is a very interesting discussion,
you can be sure there will be trucks with Mazda motors for the next 10 years or so... they won't suddenly go away.
you can also be sure that if the market doesn't think the new motor is worth keeping, they will come out with something different.
(and go figure, ?no multiple engine options for yale-hyster?)
"it's not rocket surgery"
  • Posted 23 Jan 2015 11:53 AM
Reply Report
  • WJL24
  • Ohio, United States
They offer the PSI 2.4 or the Kubota 2.5
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 12:08 AM
Reply Report
PSI is not an engine brand per se. They take the engine from the manufacturers and install the LPG fuel system. GM and the others don't want to be 'bothered' by the relatively small volumes of the forklift industry so they work through PSI aka PGL
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 12:14 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
From what I can tell from Googling images and configurations, cross checking with the limited information I've gotten from PSI and NACCO, I'm about 95% certain that it is based on the Mitsubishi 4G6#.

My Yale dealer still hasn't been able to provide me with any additional information. I'm about ready to pick up the phone and call PSI myself.
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 12:56 AM
Reply Report
PSI is the MOR, Manufacture of Record, for the engines emissions system. It can only be the one of the manufacturers.
GM and Mazda have dropped their industrial engines and NACCO has gone to PSI for their alternative. The PSI 2.4 will be standard and the Kubota will be the Premium option. Sure looks like a Mitsi base.
The problem is trying to keep up with emission regulations.
MCFA used Nissan engines for some models.
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 03:16 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
Just got off the phone with PSI.

Yes, it is an industrialized version of the Mitsubishi 4G6# in both 2.0L and 2.4L displacements.

Yes it is an interference engine, with 5K hr belt change interval.

PSI responsible for the final assembly of the Mazda engines as well, so there is some positive history with them.

So there you have it.
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 04:06 AM
  • • Modified 24 Jan 2015 04:07 AM by poster
Reply Report
From what I have been able to find it looks like it will be the Mitsubishi 4G series but only the block. It appears that PSI is working with a joint venture company to have the blocks produced. Not sure on the rest of the engine components but most of those are available already. PSI does manufacture one of the very large GM engines them selves, can not remember which size, because GM quit making it. If you Google "PSI 2.0-2.4 ENGINES" exactly how I have it without the parenthesis the first 2 results should be a file shareholder website that has a PDF with a little more information in it from 2012.
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 04:16 AM
Reply Report
  • Beeker
  • Indiana, United States
They were definitely reluctant to refer to it as a Mitsubishi engine, so other than basic architecture, I don't know how much Mitsubishi content remains. Based on the article you reference, sounds like just the engine block.

The valve cover bolt pattern seems to match that of the SOHC 4G6#, so there is some commonality in the cylinder head too. BUT.... here's where it gets interesting.... the intake and exhaust sides are reversed from what you'd find on the passenger vehicle engine (or the Mazda engine it replaces). Hmmm....

FWIW, Mitsubishi Engine North America makes no mention of this engine in any of their materials.
  • Posted 24 Jan 2015 04:34 AM
Reply Report
Total replies: 32. Showing items 1 - 20 of 32 results.
12

Having trouble using the Discussion Forums? Contact us for help!

Forkliftaction.com accepts no responsibility for forum content and requires forum participants to adhere to the rules. Click here for more information.
Ads
©Forkliftaction.com
Forkliftaction Media Pty Ltd
PO Box 1439
Milton QLD 4064
Australia
Contact Forkliftaction.com
About Forkliftaction
The Forkliftaction Team
Privacy Policy
Site Map
Help 		Business Directory
Discussion Forums
Industry News
Events Calendar
Jobs & Resumes
Photo Galleries 		Blog articles
Our Bloggers

Industry Brands
Company Index
Regions & Countries 		Machinery-onQ.com

Advertise on Forkliftaction
Editorial Features / Calendar
Featured Businesses
Past News Editions
Industry Associations
Storing your login information automatically.

When you select the 'Remember me' option, your login information will be stored on your computer in the form of a cookie. When you visit Forkliftaction.com again, the stored login information will be retrieved automatically and you will not have to submit your login parameters (email address and password) each time you want to visit our members-only pages.

A cookie is a small piece of data that is sent to your browser from a web server and stored on your computer's hard drive. A cookie can't read data off your hard disk or read cookie files created by other sites. Cookies do not damage your system.

x

MAIL A FRIEND