Thank you for the kind words.
I agree with Easy M that this is not the exception to the rule. Many companies do it right and probably even better. We can never stop learning and this is the main reason I read the posts completely. I have learned from all of you.
For the ones who don't seem to understand the fact that mechanics need to be treated with respect I challenge you to listen to them. You will gain insight into your customers and have better understanding of the challenges they face in today's world.

When I was a mechanic the two most important things to me were trust and training. I knew that i had to earn the right to get both.
Trust is something that you need to be successful on the road, if you feel like your boss is constantly looking over your shoulder then you should ask yourself if you have earned his trust. If you feel that you should have earned it and don't get it then you may have a bad manager and need to move on. Life is too short to work under the watchful eye of an incompetent manager. Trust me when I say that the best way to weed these guys out is when mechanics leave and it comes down to who they won't work for.

Training is very expensive for a dealership. It cuts into productivity and comes with high costs. BUT IT MUST BE DONE!!!
The worst feeling for any mechanic is to go out on a call that they have no idea what to do to fix the customers problem.
Lets take the cost and look at it from the dealerships perspective.
Mechanics wage Lets use 20.00 an hour for the exercise.
Benefits are 22% of the wage.
Not billing during training, so lets use the recovery rate of 75.00 per hour.
So every hour of training cost the dealership 99.40 per hour
We have 100 mechanics and budget for 40 hours a year for each.
Our budget for 08 is over 400,000.00.
Is it worth it- Yes and yes
I think that dealers that dont commit or offer training are afraid of losing people right after they spend all the money training them. To this I say you need to take a hard look at why they are leaving. A mechanic comes to work for a company looking to find a home; if he leaves then you need to ask why. They dont come to work for you just to get training and leave so look deeper into your service departments and you will find there is some other underlying reason that they are not happy.
Sorry I rambled but to me right now in our trade the training seems to be a hot topic, When you receive it from your dealership let them know that you appreciate it and will do everything in your power to return the investment to the dealer. Remember that any training you receive is yours to keep for the rest of your career. I think online training is great but the hands on practical training I got back in the 70's and 80's is still with me today and I use it all the time to help others.
Dealers need to provide the tools, training and fair wages for the mechanic but without respect and trust they wont stay long.
Mechanics need to provide 8 hours of work for 8 hours of pay and give respect back to the dealership managers who spend all the time making sure that you have a place to work.
Proshadetree:
To answer your question about using GPS as a monitoring tool. No I would never allow it to be used for this. I agree with you that a manager should know if there is a problem and act on it according to many factors and not what GPS says. It is a part of the process but should never be used as big brother or it will not gain you the things from my previous post.
We measure our mechanics on productivity, creativity, customer satisfaction and professionalism. If I have these traits in a mechanic then all the rest falls in line.
Gross profit and dollar contribution should not be a part of any measurement with mechanics. No one is a number and I have never met anyone who liked being one.
Roadrat:
You are right that being a road mechanic takes a special person. Not only do they have to be high caliper mechanics but they have to be good<

Mcracing is not the exception to the rule. This same type of scenario is being duplicated all over the country. One of our dealers in Alabama was the first in the industry to install GPS units on his vans and he would tell you the exact same thing that mcracing did. I have been in this business for over 20 years and know literally hundreds of technicians. The technicians that do their job have no problem with the device on their vans and over time forget that they are even there.

To proshadetree : Most "newbe" roadies struggle with "time management" and the ability to work by themselves.

You can't just take any shop guy, put him in a van, with a handfull of work order forms and turn him loose, most will not last.

I feel that some usefull information from an experienced Tech shared with a "GREEN" Tech could help him adjust to his new World,
Working in a shop is totally different, you have someone taking care of scheduling, lining up the work, dealing with customers, and so on.

A few pointers would help a bunch.

Roadrat cool ideal.I know some say you fire 12 then retrain then fire.You are overlooking the fact that only 1 or 2 terminated will affect the whole workforce.Almost every tech out there will admit they need more training.Online is ok class room what have you.In the fast pace times we live in we have 4 or more fuel systems out there 4 or more
electric controls.Then your working on other brands with the same.The one class I never seen offered to a road tech is a bussiness management class.Would it help?What about time management.Some of the people in the workforce think John Q Company is making millions so I dont have to do all that Ill let everyone else carry me.
I or Roadrat or anyone could start our own take all the risk
front all the capitol and watch p's and q's.But is that not why a lot of us are where we are? I dont want the risk
chances are my company will be here tomorrow.I just hate seeing it bleed dry.Im sure working conditions would improve if slackers were at least up to speed.More profit for company more for you.Tight times at work tight times for you.

TO: batman,

I went back over the post by mcracing, because I was not only impressed, but intrigued by it, and a thought came to me and wanted to run it by you and the Forum Guys.

A good manager, (with the emphasis on "GOOD", a "MM "would not consider this ,mostly, because it was not "His" idea) that uses GPS after a period of monitoring for let's say 6 to 8 months could essentially "Guage" his road guys and from the information see who is the most productive and profitable in conjuction with feed back from his assigned customers ----take that information ---Find out what these TECHS are doing that makes them sucessful and use to help the TECH who might be either struggling and might need a little help to bring him up to speed, I am not refering to the "SLACKER", but the TECH that has the potential to be better but needs some pointers to help him.

For all the great results of gps,Did you use it as your only tool to watch over techs.When you get right down to it if your the service manager your job is to watch techs and to ensure they are doing what they say they are.Not the only part but an important one.I just hate for anyone to think its the magic bandaid.

Response to mcracing :"Thank you for your honesty, I wish every
Manager could read your post, They could learn from it!"

You are one of the "very " few that feels that way and your post has renewed my hope, Maybe someday they will all get it!

WOW, mcracing summed up the entire discussion in one post.

GPS is a valuable tool if used correctly. You will have some problems upon implementation but in the long run it will pay off and techs who do what they are suppossed to be doing can practically ignore the GPS all together. Customer retention and customer service are key and any tool that helps with these two important factors of a service business is no longer an option but absolutely essential equipment.

I believe mcracing is genuine because of what he said about being a sales person. I was in outside sales for new trucks for some time and I can say this: Any sales person who is pulling their weight is not working 6 or 7 hours a day, they are working long hard hours, 10 or 12 hours sometimes. And remember, this is for commission, not hourly pay, no overtime and you need to "cold call" constantly. You will definately gain new respect for sales people once you actually do the job, but that being said there is no better pay off than selling a new truck to a new customer and beating out 4 or 5 competitors and you weren't the low price.

This has been a great, informative discussion with loads of great posts so far.

mcracing,
if what you say is true you are the exception for sure.

I have found this a very interesting topic. From my perspective and 33 years in the industry you have all very valid points to consider.
One of the posts said that they have never heard of a GM coming from a service background.
Here is a little of my history.
13 years as a road mechanic. I started in a grease truck and eventually was one of those premadona road toads who wanted to work 4 hours, billed 8 to 10 for the company and thought I should be allowed to go home at noon. My customers loved me right. Never a complaint about a bill! What's the problem.
Spent one year as an aftermarket salesman, during that year I realized what it was like to have to be the one to go and see the customer when he didn't need anything; suddenly I was no longer the hero. During this year I gained new respect for what sales people go through.
After complaining enough about a bad service manager at the company I was asked if I could do it better. Not thinking before I spoke the next thing I knew that was my new title. Service Manager. I did that job for 8 years at two different companies.
One day I got a call from the factory and next thing I knew I was the regional manager for 26 states.
Next a Branch Manager for 10 years and very recently I accepted the title of GM
240 employee's and over 100 road mechanics in vans.
I have seen many things come and go in the service side of our business over the years but the topic of abusing time is still an issue that drives management crazy.
Here are a few thoughts I have.
Do I have GPS- Yes on every van, transport truck and parts trucks. For over three years now
Do I save on fuel- Yes over 18% reduction since implementation.
Do I save on insurance- Yes 10% annually.
Is it a tool- yes
Is it used to provide customer service- yes
Does it control speeding- yes
Has it improved our response time- Yes
Is it used for anything else- Yes, We use it to receive time cards, parts tickets and bill directly from the information.
Did we have push back - Yes
Did we lose mechanics because of it - Yes
Was it bypassed- Yes
Have I ever terminated or disciplined from its information - yes
Have we improved on productivity - Yes
Have we used it to defend a mechanic who had it reported that he was not at the customers for as long as he said - Yes
Have we used it to credit a customer when it was reported that a mechanic was not there as long as he was billed - Yes
Have we been able to keep rates down because of its use -Yes
Do we use it daily to check up on mechanics - No
Do we use it as a primary tool to discipline - No
The main point I wanted to make is that GPS can be used for good things. The customer is the real beneficiary when it is used correctly.
I understand how it can be seen as a BIG BROTHER and used to make up for management deficiancies.
I look at it this way
If I have to take off a 3/8 nut and have two wrenches in my hand, One a 9/16 boxed end and the other a crescent wrench. Both will do the job but one has higher risk than the other of causing damage to the nut.
What one would you chose.

Don't ever forget your roots if you do move up, and don't ever try to understand the problems of a job you have no experience at. Communication is the key to the best customer service. Keep that open and you will always sleep good at night.

I respect everyone in our industry and have never forgot that the mechanics our our front line.

RESPONSE TO: batman,

"Good point, batman, I can see where your coming from."

and I think you hit the nail on the head,,, it really does boil down to "roi".
If it is a -real world- return on investment, then everyone is all for it, but if it is an investment in a power trip for a foolish manager, then no one wants to give up that money...

Well, roadrat, here's what I think:

Some of the larger forklift service company's can have 100 or more road techs. Think about that for a while. Out of the 100 how many fit into the great tech category, the average tech category and the poor tech category. Now, by poor tech I don't necessarily mean that they can't fix something but that they dog the system for as much as they can. Let's say 30% (probably a conservative estimate) fit into the poor tech category and you have 40 techs. That means out of 40 techs you have 12 bad ones, each costing the company an average of 3 hours per day due to overbilled travel, rental, PM's, rework, etc. That's 36 hours per day x 5 days per week x 52 weeks = about 9,360 hours per year x $45 internal rate = $421,200.

Now, it is true you don't need GPS to single out these tech's, they are good at singling themselves out. So a company can fire every one of them (my favorite approach) and rehire 12 more guys, go through training and send the next 12 out. This could go on for months or years until you get a full crew of even average techs. In the mean time all the other techs are booking massive overtime, customer service is poor and the company is spending loads of money on training and other crap.

Or, you can just install GPS on everyone's van to keep the 12 slackers in line. I think this is the prevailing reason for GPS. It is the most cost effective and easiest way to keep your poor tech's doing what they are suppossed to do. I think it's a poor approach but it must work because GPS is becoming commonplace.

My approach would be to have a warning type system where tech's get a certain number of warning's, then days in the street, then fired. Your service department would have a revolving door but why bring great and average techs down to a mediocre level by showing them you don't trust them with GPS. Or, have a great service manager that can properly implement GPS and not **** off his good people, like that'll happen.

Our use 1 batt hot 1 ground 1 key start its on all the time.
It starts recording or sending when truck starts.I had to swap mine into new van

Proshade, really, it takes -3- jumpers, one for Batt neg, one for Batt Pos and one for "Key on" Pos.
But _I_ didn't ever tell anyone that...