Discussion:
Emissions is one thing! Lets talk about the bottom line! Fuel consumption?

We hear a lot of talk back and forth, on who has the cleanest running truck? I have been hearing back from a lot of customers with these new great running trucks. The cost of fuel LPG has almost doubled. While operating the same hours as the older trucks? Moving the same amount of product. Some customers with leased trucks are now seeing the fuel truck twice a week? I guess to run cleaner is better? But the cost to do it is a poor subject? Who makes the best fuel efficient truck? Lowest fuel consumption?
  • Posted 1 Jun 2007 03:33
  • Discussion started by ETS1
  • New Jersey, United States
Showing items 1 - 14 of 14 results.
The Toyota 8 series has done very well with fuel consumption. I have done surverys in some major companies and the Toyota each time has come out on Top. There may be some info on this particular subject if you go to the toyota web site check it out
  • Posted 27 Nov 2007 15:11
  • Reply by patrick_l
  • Pennsylvania, United States
The Toyota 8 series has done very well with fuel consumption. I have done surverys in some major companies and the Toyota each time has come out on Top. There may be some info on this particular subject if you go to http://www.toyotaforklift.com/. check it out.
  • Posted 27 Nov 2007 15:08
  • Reply by patrick_l
  • Pennsylvania, United States
forktrkman,

You're right about the Linde. Problem is, not many companies track fuel consumption. Big mistake! They may buy a cheaper truck upfront and save a few thousand dollars but burn twice the fuel over the next five years.
  • Posted 9 Nov 2007 00:20
  • Reply by EasyM
  • South Carolina, United States
In true fuel comsumption Linde diesels/lpg units with hydrostatic drives win this race hands down. In operating range from creep to 8-9 mph engine is running at only 1050 rpm. Barely above idle speed. This also allows a 1000 hour pm service interval which is twice as good as any other torgue converter drive unit made today.
In another area of fuel comsumption 80volt electrics in either cushion or pneumatic made by Linde and Jungheinrich are very cost effective as well. I have seen these units run upto 14 hrs on a single charge with recharge cost of approx $2-3 dollars US making these easily justifiable with $100 per barrel oil as of this date. Europe has had high energy cost for many years so that shows why they have designed their lift trucks with that in mind.
  • Posted 8 Nov 2007 12:29
  • Reply by forktrkman
  • oklahoma, United States
Warren,

I certainly look forward to the development of the new battery for electric forklifts. Perhaps a few other factors to look into to make the use of electric forklifts more attractive:

- lighter batteries (no need to use large overhead cranes for battery change

- portable charger, mounted with forklift (helps to dispense with the need of a large battery storage and charging room)

- longer run time (drivers need not run charge up battery too often as it disrupts work operations)

- economical (battery should not cost exhorbitantly high)
  • Posted 9 Oct 2007 17:36
  • Reply by chewingyu
  • Singapore, Singapore
Hi all, i am new to this site. I am a venture capitalist and we are introducing a new lithium ion battery technology to your marketplace.
The big difference using lithium vs lead acid is 5-6 times the run times and a much shorter charge time (can re-charge up to 80% in 15-20 minutes). They will also outlast the lead acid systems considerabley.
The operating costs are similar to lead acid as well.
Hopefully this will make your jobs easier and make an impact on this market.
Well, we are just getting out of the gates so this wont be on everyones doorstep tomorrow as new technology adoption is not an overnight thing, but wish us luck.
  • Posted 28 Sep 2007 04:53
  • Reply by warren_d
  • Alberta, Canada
the most fuel efficient truck is stills rx70 european standard vdi test is the standard that all trucks are tested on 60 cycles it uses 2.1l of diesel these trucks use half the fuel compaired to most trucks yes i said half this is due to the efficiancy of hybrid drive please feel free to check up on this the least efficiant truck on the market is hysters fortis 5.8l on 60 cycles thats more than double the fuel
  • Posted 27 Sep 2007 06:46
  • Reply by gary_d
  • scotland, United Kingdom
Johnr: Understand how the emissions work & the differences in the older trucks and newer trucks. One of my family member own a large propane company on the east coast. But I also know for fact! The new computerized trucks are using more fuel. Bottom line more fuel more $s. When you replace a fleet of trucks, and the customer can prove with his bills. He is using more fuel. Not just one customer! Dealers should be told & sales people should be told, to be able to explain the reason why! Manufactures know it & should list it? I think they do list, electric truck batteries are rated to run 6 hrs in a normal shift. If you want to talk about cars? Don't they list rated miles per gallon on the sales stickers? If they listed the information on fuel consumption. Like on cars? I wonder if the purchasing agents would be interested it? ETS
  • Posted 9 Jun 2007 13:14
  • Reply by ETS1
  • New Jersey, United States
ETS,

1. What you or your customer needs to is to go back to the supplier of the old trucks and get a fuel consumption charger on teh "older" trucks and get the same on the new models.

2. Secondly not all LPG fuel is the same. LP fuel can be either butane or propane or a mixture of both - butane has a signifcant higher heating value rating (BTUs) than propane or will generate more power. It may be possible that the LPG supplier has made a change based on price, availablity, etc

3. What ever the effects of the new EPA lift trucks emissions standards maybe the lift trucks manufactures had to comply with these standards -some manufactuers made complete engine changes to do so. Engine back pressure is not always a bad thing - all engines need to have a bit of back pressure to assure acceptable life - unless they run the NASCAR or Dandy Don Garlits circuit.
  • Posted 9 Jun 2007 06:13
  • Reply by johnr_j
  • Georgia, United States
"Have An Exceptional Day!"
Sorry. I have mis understood. I thought you were going from running 4.5 to 5 hours on a tank down to just 3 hours on a tank. This would be around 40 % more fuel consumption if your operating time is reduced that much.
  • Posted 8 Jun 2007 12:41
  • Reply by Liftdoctor
  • Indiana, United States
Liftdoctor: I do not claim 40%. I just said, the trucks do use more fuel. The application will determine the amount of fuel used. Like I said we have more than just one customer complaining. Yes I am not doubting some are claiming more fuel consumption than others. But the bottom line is? They do use more fuel. And in some cases I know, due to the application the trucks are being used in. The fuel consumption is definitely noticeable! Like I said, everyone wants to claim they have the cleanest running truck. But don't want to talk about fuel consumption. I even seen some manufactures take out a statement in their brochure. That the new emission trucks will lower your fuel consumption. After they are being questioned. Why are they spending more money for fuel? After they got their new fleet of trucks. Would like to see some real honest reports showing the differences between the older trucks and the newer trucks? Truck for truck! Would really help clear up a lot of unanswered questions. If you know anyone that has a proven report of 3%? let us know? Speaking words is cheaper than buying fuel
  • Posted 8 Jun 2007 11:55
  • Reply by ETS1
  • New Jersey, United States
I work for a Komatsu dealer. When the computerized engines came out about two years ago, I was told in a class the truck would burn about 3% more fuel than the non computerized trucks. I believe this to be true. The older trucks run right next to the newer trucks day in and day out. If they were burning more fuel ,on the line of 40% more like you are saying, the operators would know and tell me about it. The operators know if a truck is 5% faster. They don't like changing LP tanks. They would be avoiding trucks with frequent tank changes.
  • Posted 6 Jun 2007 14:14
  • Modified 6 Jun 2007 14:17 by poster
  • Reply by Liftdoctor
  • Indiana, United States
johnr: Thanks for the info! Already heard all that & electric trucks will not fit the applications where the customers are complaining on the fuel consumption of the new trucks. We know with cat converters and back pressures, engines are going to use more fuel. But in today's world we are dealing with budgets. When you want keep a customers and replace his fleet with these new computerized trucks that can not be messed with. And we hook up our computers and find the engine is running in spec. But is still eating fuel, and the truck is being worked the same amount of time as his older truck. So we are going to blame the operator for needing to change a bottle of fuel that did not make a whole shift? Glad you said 4.5-to 5 hours. How about 3 hours? Like I said everyone want to brag & say they have the cleanest running truck. Maybe they should do a fuel consumption survey on the IC trucks? Could be a great selling feature in this business. Especially when you know you do have the most fuel cost efficient truck. I know the manufactures have to comply with the same emissions. But they don't put anything in there literature or brochures that will tell you with complying to the government emissions. The truck will use more fuel! Bottom line is, it will cost you more money to operate the computerized truck. Just want to know if any manufacture is doing any testing on this issue? With all the electronics on IC and electric trucks today. It looks like the manufactures are trying to stay up with the competition? But they are getting away from the most important selling feature. A PROVEN PRODUCT!
  • Posted 2 Jun 2007 13:23
  • Reply by ETS1
  • New Jersey, United States
1. All lift trucks manufactures have to comply to the same emissions standards as every one else - EPA Tier II standards and soon Tier III standards - so how clean is clean?

2. Fuel efficency is a matter of the operator,work cyscle, engine charactreistics, etc. (capacity per capacity most trucks have the same size engine). Engine performance today is controlled by computers, etc and your can't mess around with the settings - they tend to run leaner to meet emissions requirements. There are no standard means of measuring and comparing mpg of lift trucks brands.

3. If the major concern is fuel cost - look at electrics -to save energy cost. For example, it costs about $20.00 per refill on a 33# LPG tank and teh unit should run about 4.5 - 5 hours per tank full. To recharge the battery in an electric - the cost of electricilty is about $2.85 and the truck will run the same amount of time. The $$ saved pays back the initial higher cost. Plus electric run longer befor major repairs 12 - 14000 hours vs 8000 - 10000 on ICE trucks

4. Now electrics aren't for all applications - they don't like a lot of use on ramps, running in the rain ain't too good for them also, yep - some one needs to be responsible for battery maintenance - watering not over watering), equalize charing, etc. With 48 v batteries & charges the lifting and travel speeds are comparable to electrics. In multiple shift operations and battery charging and changin stations must be set up, etc.

This is just some infor to share with you.
  • Posted 2 Jun 2007 01:59
  • Reply by johnr_j
  • Georgia, United States

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