Showing items 21 - 40 of 41 results.
Yes, the standard applies to all industrial trucks, including forklifts, excluding only remote controlled machines.
These "trucks used for towing trailers" - Are they forklift trucks?
In ISO 3691.1 -2011 (actually under revision), chapter 4.12 states:
..............................
4.12
Devices for towing
Trucks used for towing trailers shall be fitted with towing or coupling devices designed, constructed and arranged to reduce hazards of connection and disconnection and to prevent accidental disconnection during use.
..............................................
As you see the "trucks used for towing trailers" expression is used.
In other chapters of this ISO standard (6.3.1.3 for example) the requirements for Tractors are specified.
As a concluson - ISO considered towing application for forklifts as a kind of standard.
is there any mention of what type of hitch you are to use exactly? something to think about...
Just checked it.
In the actual Linde 392 driver manual, in the data sheet, the drwabar pull in N is specified (it's about 13-15 kN).
In other sheets the the trailer weight with load is specified too.
It means that the towing operation is allowed, of course preserving all the safety issues.
PPPA,
What happened the box car started rolling down a modest grade, the lift's braking system could not stop the momentun of box car, the lift was attached to the box car, all came to a stop at the rail dead head.
Never heard of a fatality involving a forklift towing, but the risk is always present. If unreasonable loads are tried, some component is bound to fail before the truck gets underway. I've seen broken pins and counterweights hanging off their mountings. Operators wonder why rear tyres wear out in no time compared with the front tyres. Steering racks aren't built to handle the extra load on the rear axle. The rear axle isn't built to handle the extra load on the rear axle. Transmission etc.
For a long time I haven't seen mention of the tow pin can be used for towing in operators manuals or truck specs. Maybe it was there back in the day.
It would be easy for lawyers prove that a company cut corners not buying a tow truck and let the forklift do the work. These days they could win a whack of cash for winning that suit. Too late for the operator though.
You have to remember that our Constitution was written by lawyers and they keep getting more "creative" in their interpretation of teh Constitution & the laws to maintain an income especially the recent graduates from law school. They act like a bunch of brand new commissioned lift truck sales people at times -say anything to get the order.
The little I know about tow tractors -there is a "rule of thumb" that says 1 lb of draw par pull can pull a trailered weight of 50 lbs. w/low friction tires on a flat level grade (this was published in a Claark manual for Tow Traactors many, many moons ago. This means a tractor rated 200 lbs continious draw bar pull woudl be capabale of towing 10,000lb (including the trailer weight). Some misguided sales type might inform a customer that his lift truck with a rated drawbar pull of say 2000 lbs. could tow 100,000 lbs. In reality, mos load would be much less than that
While certainly this would put a strain on the drive train, more importantly is the braking capability of the machine. When a foklift is empty there is les weight on the driving tires ~35 to 40% of the GVW. By pulling a load of any weight via the pin in the counterweight more weight would be transferred to the steering tires and less on the drive tires. That equals less braking capability - especially when the rolling load momentun starts pushin forward during braking.
Yes, I can recall (many moons go) a fatal accident involving a fork lift pulling a box car around a paved rail siding inside a plants operation (the were using an 8K dual drive pneuamtic with two speed torque converter single disc power shift tranny w/mechanical clash gear low speed gear box (Borg Warner T-12) as a spotter. The company didn't want to spend the money for a "Spotter" w/ occassional use (aka dust collector) - even those lawyers fresh out of law school could win this suit.
I think Linde is here like a toad from an old joke (when lion ordered the animals to split into two groups - the wise and the beautifull, the toad screamed - I cannot tear apart!)
One issue is the law.
According to my knowledge there's no strict interdiction of towing operation by the industrial trucks (specially when some of the trucks are designed for towing). Of course there are some safety issues and I do not support such application, but during more the 25 years of acticity I never heard about any accident caused by the fact that the trailer was towed by the forklift, not by a tractor.
The other issue is the marketing.
Linde officially doesn't support such praxis, but as a hydrostatic transmission manufacturer, they are pretty proud, that their transmission isn't in danger while towing.
I've personally seen the Linde salesman from Germany, who was "working" on the customer saying that he can tow the big trailers with no risk to the truck.
Concerning the Polish lawyers (and probably most of the European), they are a bit differently orientated.
And there's less of them here.
Every machine has limits. These limits are clearly identified on the machine - SWL for cranes, max load at load centre for lift trucks...etc
I would assume that a tow truck has the max load that it can tow clearly marked.
In Europe, if an industrial machine is put into operation doing something it's not designed to do, the factory operator wouldn't have a leg to stand on if someone got hurt and put a claim in.
Sure - some folks use forklifts for towing, just the same as a 5T truck gets to lift 7T the odd time - doesn't make it right.
Forklift suppliers shouldn't be telling operators that they can tow.
I understand what you are saying but what does Linde have to say about the practice. People use forklfits in ways that aren't recommended but when something happens that's when the Philadelphia laywyers have a field day. Maybe you have Warsaw lawyers that aren't so agressive as we have in the States. Most overseas companies that have operations in the US are afraid of & have a hard time understand our legal system especially in P/L matters (most of us in the US do to).
I recall an incidient that happened in Mexico City where a lift truck that our company sold to a dealer in Mexico who resold it to a well known company that was head quaretered in the US. The lift was driven with into an elevator the cables broke & gravity took over - the operator did not survive. Our distributor reported this accident, as we required, our P/L & legal council folks got really up tight and wanted all the info about this now so they could start preparing for an expected law suit. Our dealer in Mexico said don't worry nothing will happen & it never did.
One more cent to the topic.
Just two days ago, while visiting the customer (just courtesy) I witnessed the H35D Linde forklift towing the two empty freight carriages. When I suggested it's not a best application for the forklift, the cutomer answered, that he needs to tow the carriages once a week or two and there's no need to buy a special tractor for this. The truck manages very good.
Somehow - I understand him. Specially, when there's no drivetrain risk for the trucks with hydrostatic transmission.
When overcharged, they simply "switch off" the traction (the relief valve opens).
One thing that leads people to believe that a forklift can be used as a towing vehicle is most manufacturers continue to publish "draw bar pull" (empty & loaded) ratings on their specifications sheets. Guess the spec is used to indicate the "power" at the drive wheels of the lift. Once upon a time we used to demo the power of our forklift that was made in Japan by chaining our lift to the competitors lift via the counterweight pins and would drag the competitors unit any where we wanted. The specs sheets seemed to indicate the comptitors should have won the tug of war battle. And we would give any prospective customer a $100 bill if they could find a a drop of oil underneath our new stock inventory. Never paid out once and that $100 bill started to turn brown.
I believe using the term tow truck or tow tractor to describe forklift is outdated.
Drawbar pull is used to compare similar vehicles in terms of the basic power.
The pin at the back is for getting a broken truck back to the workshop.
Depends on the intended use. In a pinch a lift can pull, but it's not designed to do this all day long. Drivetrain issues, as well as safety issues come into play.
@swoop223
Probably small misunderstanding, sorry for not being clear.
Probably, as usual, I was writing the post and, and speaking to the mobile paralelly ;-)
"Industrial trucks" is a term used in all standards (ISO, BS, DIN, EN) for the entire range of machines we are dealing with.
This term describes everything - from non powered pallet movers, to the huge, 50 tons container handlers.
Sometimes the forklifts are commonly understood as a synonyme for the entire range. That's why I reacted.
Anyway, swoop's post was obviously true and reasonable.
Comparing counterbalanced trucks (this is standardized term for forklifts as we commonly understand it) with tow tractors is definitely not correct, because of what swoop's has written.
From the other hand, I remember, that in 90's the ISO standards included the term "drawbar pull" for forklifts. It meant, that the legislation assumed the towing application for the trucks.
Technically it is possible, all the trucks have towing bolts on the counterwieights.
Economically - well, for me it makes no sense, unless the normal utilisation of the forklift is very low and there is a time reserve. But it's better to optimize the forklift utilization (reduce the forklift fleet for example, and buy some tow tractor instead)
Thanks for your inputs. I think my question was a unclear. What I meant was the integration of these two in a work place as to the kanban ideology because many still uses the forklifts for horizontal movement for their operations.
actually my rather broad statement was specifically made to make a simple distinction between the two
a forklift is designed to do a specific job as the tug also is designed to do a specific job. Certain specifications between the two are so far apart on the scale they can hardly be compared as anything other than what they are.
I'm still wondering where kariat's comment about 'industrial' came into play. We all know either machine would most likely be industrial by design. ;o)
kariat,
Waht I beleive swoop is saying is tahat interial forklift trucks (non tow trators or tugges or what every they be called) are not designed to perform a trailer or rail car (don't laugh that has happened" towing function. - for example, Komatsu, Mitsubishi, Cat & Clark cleary state in their operators manual for their counter balance forklift lift trucks that this is a no, no.
Once upon a time, everyone (lift truck manufacturers) in the US offerd a pintle type or similar tow hook option on their lift (Ford Motor cCompany used to buy them for their assembly plants) but no one does any more. Strongly suspect, lawyers,
P/L lawsuits w/ big pay outs & a revision of our OSHA standards had a lot to do with this. Those little pins recesseed in teh back of a counterweight adn only to be used to secure teh lift on to a delivery truck or wench a lift on to a tilt bed when lift is "dead in the water".
Maybe things are different in other parts of world but our standards are including more for teh EU & I suspect teh EU standards in cldue more of teh North American standards (Canada tends to adopt many of the same stds as the US but I am certain they have some of their own, especially in the province wherever Montreal is located. See at one time - when I had acne, my voice was changing and the Detroit River was only clean on one side, Canada Chrysler used to build a car that was a hybrid - 1/2 Plymouth & 1/2 Dodge. I grew up on the very polluted side of the Detroit River.)
If you don't mind, swoop, it's not exactly as you say.
According to terminology standards, tow tractors are treated as industrial trucks.
Still, Linde, Crown, BT, Jungheinrich etc - all manufacture them
and sell as a trucks, sometimes naming them tugger trains, sometimes - tow tractors.
Their destination is specialistic, but it doesn't change the fact - they are the industrial trucks.
From the other hand, the question from our Malaysian colleague is a bit absurd. It's hard to comment the differences between the two identical machines.
Forkliftaction accepts no responsibility for forum content and requires forum participants to adhere to our rules of conduct. Click here for more information.
If you are having trouble using the Discussion Forums, please contact us for help.