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innovation in materials handling
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
have just watched a video on youtube were Gorden Riske and Eike Bohm talk about how they see innovation shaping KION by 2020 , you might seem to get the impression that KION will look at adding more complicated hardware to gather info on the customer and their operation's to their equipment then to charge extra for this service.

But is this were the real innovation that a customer requires comes from. It is Ok have a fully automated facility but what will happen if this was to brake down would this close the full facility if there is no manual over ride allowing manual trucks in to do the order picking.

Also we have seen that customers don't really like the complicated trucks used in europe in north america one reason KION and junghienrich don't really do well in this market as against Toyota and Crown.

From what our research tells us customers want a machine that will not cost the earth to purchase , will not cost the earth to fix, is simple to maintain but effective at doing the job and can be fixed in a mater of hours not days if a fault arises.


So who is right are KION right in saying that the customer would like a more complicated machine that can gather information that will be more complicated to fix and you must have a certain company in to fix these at a higher cost


or do customers want a simple but effective truck that gets the job done that is able to be fixed by a competent person form any company at a lower cost

How will this effect companies like the Chinese companies coming to the market will they now look at adding more complicated data gathering equipment to their machines or will they go back to basics with less electrical equipment and more manual equipment and how will this effect the market KION and Junghienrich do very well in Europe but not in other markets, will Europe now look to follow North America for a simple but effective truck at a lower cost or will North america see the benefits of having a more complicated truck as a way to lower total running cost of their material handling equipment
  • Posted 10 Apr 2016 10:16 PM
  • • Modified 10 Apr 2016 10:27 PM by poster
Total replies: 19. Showing items 1 - 19 of 19 results.
Replies
  • bbforks
  • Pennsylvania, United States
I can tell you from my client's point of view, these newer trucks with the complicated & expensive electronics are viewed as a major pain in the a**. As my signature states, they love the newer technology when they purchase the machine, but hate when they find out how expensive & time consuming the repairs on the technology are. Once they get bitten with the true cost of technology, they steer clear the next time a purchase is to be made.

bbforks (at) Hotmail (dot) com
Customers love technology- until they have to pay to fix it!
  • Posted 20 Apr 2016 11:55 PM
I agree. In some cases, example: emission control on ICE trucks, it is mandated by government. The complexity is inherent in the system. Things like telemetry are nice until the customer starts getting alerts on their PC or phone in the middle of the night. I sometimes would like to go back 20 years when equipment was simpler.
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 12:58 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
This will be what happens, customers will choose the basic truck over the compercated trucks , you can have a basic tier V truck with out all the tech
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 12:34 PM
  • • Modified 21 Apr 2016 12:35 PM by poster
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
The competition will change and force the big companies out , there will be a simple easy to maintain low cost truck , and rental companies that you can use your smart phone to book a rental like UBER has done to transport

The big companies look at only a small part of the market but these companies will quickly change when they see new entries comming in offering better service for lower cost
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 12:55 PM
Until somebody comes up with a lift truck that will pass any and all emission standards, never break down , needs no PM service and is totally and completely idiot proof things are the way they are. I deal with people every day that I really wonder how they find their way to work just so they can drive a lift truck. Transmission controllers, engine control modules and emission standards and truck controllers are a way of life because of rules , regulations and lack of training of operators. Sure there is a market for your low end junk, put it in a harsh operating environment and see who whines and cries when it broke down all the time with no parts support.
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 08:57 PM
Amen to that Triumphrider, spot on.
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 09:29 PM
Forklifts have been the same for years and the only one difference customers will seek is Total cost of ownership. That's [url removed] way in which the customer saves up money? lots of ways... productivity, safety, consumption, [url removed]

Before creating a whole automated and complicated forklift fleet the customer will prefer to use other alternative automated machines and mechanisms in the warehouse lest costly and easier to maintain which are currently available, just look at the Inditex "city" in Galicia, Spain...
  • Posted 21 Apr 2016 10:46 PM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
I think triumphrider has got part of this right and part wrong , there is tech out their that is what we used to call *** and Liddy proof no mater what they tried it was easy to drive and simple to fix , The emissions are down to engine manufactures and have no baring on how the truck drives or how the operate can manage to break them.


There is systems out there that can allow for a simple truck in the toughest environment that will last for ever. You see Old clarks and the like that gave been running for over 50 years and still run today these truck have not had a easy life but are still in operation.


Around 80% of all break down occur around the engine and transmission the engine is easy to fix be cause it will be something simple but the transmission are now more complicated you have different drive modes ect ,. If you have a basic transmission that is efficient and doesn't need electronic control then you are on the right track.

As for emissions LPG gets around the issue of diesel



Customers don't have to pay a premium for good service there are plenty of small service companies out there who offer good service at a affordable price , the same is true when it comes to the trucks as well
  • Posted 22 Apr 2016 02:23 AM
  • • Modified 22 Apr 2016 02:27 AM by poster
You really do not understand emissions. LPG trucks are required to meet emission standards the same as diesel units. Simple trucks are not always the cheapest trucks. I will repeat what has already been said, the total running cost is what will win customers. Unless you are talking about 1-2 truck users that only look at purchase price.
  • Posted 23 Apr 2016 12:42 AM
  • bbforks
  • Pennsylvania, United States
Brewski- you're dead on! The forklift market is driven by large customers who buy fleets of forklifts at a time. Total cost of ownership is what these types of consumers look at, along with the servicing dealer in their area.

It comes down to which type of Forklift is cheaper during the intended life of the primary purchaser. In another thread on this site it's been shown that American companies keep their lifts much longer than companies across the pond. This could answer the question as to why the techy lifts don't do as well in the USA as the electronics are expensive to repair & don't hold up as well.

bbforks (at) Hotmail (dot) com
Customers love technology- until they have to pay to fix it!
  • Posted 23 Apr 2016 02:15 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
If you were to add up all the small purchases as against the fleets over a fixed period the numbers would not be much different. OEMs like to drive the fleet sales but the small company is just as important if not more important as they could be the big guy in the future.


As for the tech side OEMs would like there customers to believe they offer the best overall life time cost but when you add everything up they are likely to be higher over the years.

The longer you keep the truck the more chance of hire bills this might be why in Europe they tend to have trucks on hire no longer than five years and in North America they tend to be longer
  • Posted 23 Apr 2016 04:07 AM
The studies here in the [url removed] show otherwise. I have been in this industry for 44 years. The history is what it is. One of the primary reasons the high tech European trucks do not do well here in the [url removed] is the cost. The prices for the base unit plus the replacement parts costs are just too high.
  • Posted 23 Apr 2016 05:13 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Having just read about the Toyota design award in IVT and read about the Toyota Kamu. I think this would be a totally different solution in the warehouse environment. What a great idea this is and if it could be produced with a couple of small alterations it would really be a revolution in the industry.


Have Toyota got the guts to produce such a truck is yet to see
  • Posted 29 Aug 2016 05:15 AM
  • stam
  • Ontario, Canada
Looks like something that wouldn't last 2 hours at one of my customers.
Breaking the forks off to use as a pallet jack just seems redundant to me. I have found things designed for multi purpose uses do everything poorly as opposed to something designed for one purpose. I think the real leap forward will be something to do with the building the machine works in or transport trailer, not the machine itself.
  • Posted 29 Aug 2016 07:39 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
great idea tho like i said it would need some alterations maybe strengthening in some way
  • Posted 29 Aug 2016 08:09 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
The new Linde Roadster is claimed to be a revolution in the view the operator has. But have we not seen this before in the old Hyster big trucks of the 1970's
  • Posted 25 Sep 2016 07:10 AM
Surely progress is a good thing, and for something to be a success, it has to be practical, useful and offer a good ROI? There have been improvements and innovation in forklift and equipment design across the board, and adding complexity isn't always a bad thing. That said, there'll always be some that prefer the old Nokia 3310 to the iPhone 7!
  • Posted 24 Feb 2017 11:27 PM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Some people just like simplicity,its seems to be the younger generation that don't mind change The Linde half turning seat is a good idea
  • Posted 25 Feb 2017 05:42 PM
  • • Modified 25 Feb 2017 05:43 PM by poster
Is it like a toddler's car seat?! :)
  • Posted 2 Mar 2017 09:49 PM
Total replies: 19. Showing items 1 - 19 of 19 results.

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