I ASK EVERYONE TO PLEASE RESPOND TO THIS POST so that I can forward it to the people that need to hear it, and that can hopefully help promote a much needed change.
As I am sure we are all aware of the situation regarding the material handling industry and each manufacturer having their own software and passwords, and if you are not aware of it you will be affected by it sooner rather than later probably. (Read below for a little more information regarding it, if you are unfamiliar).
I am in the process of puting this together so that I can bring it to MHEDA (Material Handling Equipment Distributors Association) and other associations I feel could help resolve this issue, to see if we can get a much needed change in our industry. Some may agree with this and some may not but the truth of the matter is that we all continue to hurt ourselves and probably the customer the most by the way we are doing things.
Currently, most, if not all manufacturers' have set up their own software programs, cables, handsets, cords, pass codes etc. to work on their machines, now some of them work on another make or model occasionally but for the most part they are specific to that manufacturer's machine. The problem with this way of doing things is that it is making it increasingly difficult for a customer to choose who they would like to work on their equipment. With most of the dealers in my area refusing to sell the handsets, software, give pass codes etc. I understand the need for making money and I understand the benefits of not giving that software/information to your competition/customer that may do their own repairs. But my bottom line is this: The customer should have the choice of who they want to have service/repair their equipment and should not feel like they are not given a choice of who they can use by only being able to use the dealer no matter what they charge, or what customer service experience they offer etc. I have personally spoken with several customers that do not want the dealer of their make/model of equipment on their property at all (even going as far as paying other people to do non software needed work on their machine when it is under warranty even though they could have gotten their machine fixed for free). Then there are others customers that have stated to me that right now they are struggling badly and cannot afford to have the dealer of their machine do the work because they are the most expensive in the state but cannot find anyone else that has the software etc. so they feel they have no choice. Even others that cannot afford the 3 or 4 day (or sometimes longer) wait time to have the dealer of their specific machines come to repair them.
There are a lot of ways/backdoors to get the software, cables, handsets, passwords etc. that you need but it isn't always possible and it wastes time and causes un-needed frustration. I've spoken with several dealers that are torn on this because in some of their locations it benefits them because they have the majority share of the market and in other locations it hurts them.
I am not saying there are not a lot of factors involved in the way things have been done so far: liability, legality etc. But there has to be a way that we can change this for the better (like the automobile industry has) I think the main difference between us and the automobile industry is that there are not 5 material handling dealers for the same machines (ex: Hyster, Toyota etc) within the same territory or just down the street from each other. There is typically only one Material Handling dealer per make per state/territory and if a company's corporate sends a certain make of machine or if you just like the quality of a certain machine better than the others and you do not like the dealer for that machine in your territory you should not feel that you have no choice but to use them.
Bottom line the automobile industry tried to keep the software and password proprietary in the beginning and it worked until people like all of us (small businesses, independents, customers, etc) stood up and said 'enough'. And now I am saying: 'enough.' Will this affect my business in a negative way... yes it will, will it affect my business in a positive way... yes it will, but the bottom line is the customer should have the ability to choose who is right for the repair of their machines. I shouldn't, as a dealer, get to choose and neither should any other dealer or manufacturer.
My entire goal for this, is for it to be a main topic that we can all get together about and find a better solution for all of us and for the customers.
Print and send this (or refer them to this posting) to as many people as you know (customers, mechanics, independents, dealers, etc.) so that everyone is aware and able to hopefully help make a change in our industry.
I appreciate your time and look forward to your responses, There is alot of people effected by this and if we come together we can make a change.
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Chubhill - you need to to go East Texas to see the real big Texas mosquitos, they are so big that they can mate with a turkey standing flat footed.
when it comes to sausage, home grown is the best...some venison...some wild hog...a few houshold spices in the proper proportions...mmmm....Joe, is houston home?
It's in the Houston metroplex just SE of Houston. I grew up in Bossier, LA. Moved to Reno/Lake Tahoe when I was 18. The 10 years I spent out there before moving back here 16 years ago spoiled me. I now love the cold and hate the heat! But I have to say the work out here is alot better.
Amen to that johnr j. Best sausage I ever ate was from Greuns just east of Temple. Also Joe D, were is Laporte? Near Louisiana? East Tx mabye? Boliver Point had the best shrimp and flounder on the face of the earth.
Yep, used to say in Cental, West and The Gulf area of Texas, in the summer you move from A/C to A/C during the day, when the sun goes down you come out and play. But there are three in Texas you can't get anywhere else: 1. - Bar B Q (in GA they make it from the pigs b u t t & no mesquite) ,2. - Great Tex-Mex; 3. - Best Real Friends you'll ever have.
I work in Laporte and I'll tell ya this much....this past summer sucked! I started telling my boss that due to the operations shifts starting at 8 am I needed to start at 5:30 or 6 am to get any PMs done. Which is true but the flip side was getting my butt into air conditioning before the hottest part of the day!
Johnr J- Katy huh? Would you believe me if I told you I lived on the Brazos for 5 years in Angleton? About 30 miles from the coast and brackish water. Good blue crab and red fish though. Mosquitoes as big as owls and some of the nastiest tasting well water I have ever drank.
chublil;
You didn't experience humidty in Belton/Temple. I lived in Waco & skied/fished Lake Belton often. It was Hot there in the summer 100+ very often. Moved to Houston area, Katy to be exact. Now there is humidity, 90/90 (temp F/%Humidity)days from May to early Sept. Mold grew everywhere - bought X-14 by the gallons.
I support your reply on the pro tech definitions. You can actually apply those same principles to most any function - Account, Sales, Marketing, Production,etc - a Pro is always a Pro, willing to learn & willing to listen & not afraid to ask questions when in doubt, willing to share & very important be able to get along with people at all levels and realize every one came from a different life experiences -parents formal & informal educations, beliefs, possess the ability to compromise.
EdwardT, I will give you my answer to that question, "What is properly trained mean". I believe properly trained means having many years experience not only at some kind of certification level for most units, but also numerous successful repairs made on hundreds of service calls. Safety parameters on most class specific units are close to the same. Granted there are some flukes between makes that are particular to the manufacturer, but for the most part you know as a "Years of Experience tech" whats important. Articulating axles on reach trucks, steer axle stops, wear limits etc. all relate to safety and are only a few I will mention. Also with many years of road service experience you know that bumping into competing techs helps and friendships are made. Phone numbers exchanged and such all leads to a localized but effective resource bank for all involved. "Properly trained" to me means years of experience doing it successfuly, and the resources available locally to get answers on stuff your not too sure about. Also, if I as a tech dont know what to do on the repair, stopping and getting an answer before attempting to fix it shows that I am properly trained when its a safety issue. An extra two or three days of the unit being down kinda blows, but its better than feeling pressured to fix it, and having it all go south on you after a hurried repair.
Joe d, I lived in central TX for around 11 years, Temple-Belton area and I miss the fishing!!!!! I dont miss the humidity though!
Thanks. you are right,it was long, and I apologize to everyone else for the rambling distance from the thread's OP that this thread has gone.
As far as "-my- way of thinking"; if you mean I think that anyone who thinks they know it all is incorrect? Then yea, that one I am pretty hard headed about. But when I use "ignorance", I hope I mean it as 'when someone has not had the opportunity to learn that particular message' and NOT the same as 'stupid'.
I think [by your phrasing] you make an assumption that this statement somehow only applies to independents; "don't want or think you need training then you are dangerous and can create problems with a lack of education", but I am willing to bet that is actually a -universal- truth. What was that saying about "a -little- knowledge can be a very dangerous thing"?
You are correct, there are at the very least 2 sides to every story. We don't really need the O.P. if the subject thread still has interest enough for someone to bother to post, do we?
I would still appreciate a response* the the question I posed to forkliftchick (or anyone else) [that I thought had to do with the O.P.] about "what would constitute 'properly trained' that should be allowed passwords and software/hardware for some brand not the same as the logo on the truck or the building's sign. Should/would a Yale tech who was a master tech be allowed the passwords for a Hyster? Why not if 'properly trained' was the reasoning?"
* or is this a/the response and I am too dense to see the answer? If it is your reply, could you explain it a little further and help me out?
You are also correct that I took the "dinosaur" remark (and your "father time") as an age related slur, and while it might not have been intended as such, you might want to let the person who made the remark, clarify it for themselves, should they care to. (unless of course, you and bigdogs are the same person?) I also would like to clarify and apologize if you think I have said "young techs aren't as good as old" but since I don't see where I said that, I would like to demand that you do not speak for me or misquote me. in the closest message to anything relating to youth, what I did intend to convey was about -MY- own knowledge about the same skill sets that bigdogs (and maybe forkliftchick too) were claiming made "dinosaurs" of techs that did not have the same "new tech" skills as was gifted upon employees of dealerships or compared to the gifts bigdogs has acquired.
I do appreciate that where you work they have techs of various ages, I sure hope that includes some that are 60+ years old, as even though I am not quite that old, I know we all still need to work, and older worker age discrimination seems to be something I observe in this industry as "acceptable", however I may be overly sensitive, since I am no spring chicken, but I did start as a journeymen level service tech at a relatively young age.
Thanks for your replies and input.
Wow ED that was......long. From what your saying to ones that aren't following your way of thinking is ignorance as well. There are two sides to every coin. read the original post it's quite blunt in what it's saying and I haven't seen the person who started this discussion back for quite some time.
Also you're assuming that everyone that say's dinosaur is relating to age and I don't think this is the case. If you are in house and getting factory training you are up to speed and therefore will have the handsets and info readily available to you because obviously your employer has made an investment not unlike a factory tech.
But if you are an independant and don't want or think you need training then you are dangerous and can create problems with a lack of education. I'm not calling out every independant but the ones I speak of are out there and weve all seen them or cleaned up after them.
You seem to come across as a been there done that father time type. You don't know how old I am or anyone else here so stating that young techs aren't as good as old is also ignorance because where I work we all work together regardless of age and we have a lot of solid VARIOUS aged techs.
Ditto chublil's statement!!! No more playing fireman, less stress AND they're gonna pay me more money and better beni's....there were no second thoughts here!
Forkliftchick, I disagree. Most In house guys in the states cut it just fine at the factory dealerships they worked for, they just found it easier to make more money leaving said dealerships and having an account all to themselves. At a factory dealership, the grade "A" techs get to run around and clean up after the lesser skilled techs and its a constant headache putting out fires you did not start. If the factory dealerships could not provide compensation for your skills, somebody else would. Its called a job, not a hobby. The bottom line is exactly that. The more money I earn for my family, the better. Also some in house guys have access and use the same repair tracking software you speak of. This is not a selling point any longer that is exclusive to the "Factory Dealers". Also, most forklift dealerships offer truck specific certification classes just as commercial truck dealers. As an owner of a large fleet of equipment, it makes better sense long term and short to save the labor dollar from the get go. As for me personally, having worked for major dealerships in the past, the only bashing I will do now is when they dont treat me as a valued customer. Knowning how they operate internally has helped me as an in house guy achieve that.
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