After being in the service for over 35 years it has become apparent to me that it is the customer or truck owner that is unaware of the facts when it comes down to the maintainance of their vehicles when clouded with the technical rethoric that they get from sales persons from forklift companies.
Firstly, most companies try to obtain a contract to service a customers truck at least 4 times a year irrespective of the hours or conditions that the unit/s are used in.
I have always been a great believer in fair play when it comes to checking a truck then looking back into its history then finding it has only done 90 hours since last service yet I am compelled to carry out a full service because a contract says I must do so.
In the case of gas powered trucks, the cost of changing everything is nothing more than taking a customer to the cleaners as here are a few facts that customers should look at!
(1) Air filters can be blown out ( depending on conditions ) a total of 3 times before an actual replacement should be a necessity.
(2) spark plugs should only be replaced after 500 hours or failure has occured.
(3) I carried out a viscosity check on trucks that have run in excess of 1000 hours to find that the oil had maintained its viscosity within running limits to the specifications set down by Perkins for their engines.
(4) Although set out in service manuals, Hydraulic oil should be changed and new filters fitted every 6000 hours Max! yet I have yet to see anyone actually do this operation, we used to do this every 2000 hours with hydrostatic trucks.
(5) Transmissions, full service should be carried out at least every 2000 hours yet I aint been with one company in the UK that adheres to this and the onus is on the customer to get this sorted because it is not included in any service contract currently in the UK.
In the UK we dont repair problems as well as we create them for if we fixed things properly and maintained them well, we would have no job!
sound Familiar?
I was in a meeting a few years back where it was stated that as engineers we had to think to be long term greedy and not short term. that is to say! screw the customer as far as it allows!
I will say that there are possibly a few companies out there that are not **** their customers but all in all a person has to look at is, How often is that company there!are the defects resolved and sorted or does the same defect arise month after month ?
Does the engineer arrive, take a break, have lunch, then tea break then look at the unit and state, he needs parts?
I have been a dilligent and qualified engineer for many years and have seen many things that would make a genuine engineers hair stand on end with some things that are done to secure an invoice at the end of it.
I am sure that this post will either evoke a responce of remove it! or get one that says yup! been there done it!
This post has been done without malice or any form of defamation to anyone however! if you feel you fit the bill where contents in here fit your outfit then Woohoo! go for it!
Showing items 1 - 10 of 10 results.
i always use a very sparing amount of antiseize on spark plugs, as mentioned too much of it lowers the heat range of the plug and makes it slightly more prone to fouling. this isnt new to K series Nissan engines, upright VW air-cooled engines go back 50 years with the same problem...
not that it's always needed, but if you use a very sparing amount of silver grade (NOT nickel grade) antiseize on a plug you can install it like that in virtually any engine without ill effect.
my experiance/understanding of the "the relatively high temperatures involved with fork lift engines they have a tendency to seize into aluminum cylinder heads" is not actually "high temp" (and really forklifts and cars all run at the temp the cooling system is designed for) as much as it is that on some engines, the last bit of threads on the spark plug extend into the compression chamber, and after some time, they have a tendency to build up the same hard carbon depostis as the rest of the compression chamber. This is not a problem with the K21 and k25 engines as their last few threads do not extend into the compression chamber, but was a problem with the 4g series Mitsubishi motors. a coat of nev-r-seize (anti seize compound) on the spark plug threads before installing them makes a huge difference when removing them later, but this is -not- recommended for the k21-k25 engines as it can effect actual heat level of the spark plug, creating a cooler spot in the combustion chamber.
The problem is with leaving plugs to long is that with the relatively high temperatures involved with fork lift engines they have a tendency to seize into aluminium cylinder heads. We have a number of trucks come in p/ex which have this problem due to the plugs being left to long, we had a Linde in just this week with this problem! For the very low cost of spark plugs these days its not worth mucking about removing and copper greasing old ones, so we just fit a new set. We also tend to fit new cap and rotor on a service, and over the past few years this has shown up on our records to have saved us a lot of money on call outs for ignition failures. Nowadays these are also very low cost parts and not worth leaving to chance.
speaking of spark plugs, it ought to be mentioned that at least in the USA, in MCFA products, the tier 2 spec was to warranty the spark plugs (and related "tune up" components) for 3600 hours, and I would have expected other manufacturers to have the same specs.
OP I will give you the benefit of doubt and assume you meant change spark plugs at 5000 hrs and not 500---which is every second oil change give or take.
also it should be noted that viscosity is not the only property of engine oil that is important. viscosity has to be maintained at both room temperature and operating temperature, and this is accomplished by elastomeric molecules that get sheared by the rotating parts of the engine over time. also, other additives that control foaming, corrosion and wear get consumed over a limited time and given the chemicals lift trucks get exposed to, i do not like to push that envelope.
certain chemicals and especially water from stop/start condensation or outdoor storage will continue to dig and cause damage even if the lift truck is sitting idle, so even in low hour operation I dont think it is unreasonable to want to frequent the customer for check-ups more than once a year---a lot can happen to a sitting forklift in one year.
derek h - just a comment about judging the condition of oil by viscosity checking. Within oils or fluids there are additives that are also included in the oil/fluid. For example an additive in engine oil is a detergent which serves the purpose of cleaning the oil of by product from engine blowby and rust inhibtors, etc. After about 3000 miles of use in automobiles these protective additives rapidly dissapate but the oils viscosity remains relativly unchanged. This is one reason many people change the engine oil every 3K miles instead of the 6K miles recommended in the owners manual. People like me I speak of. 'Cause oil is always cheaper than metal.
Yes, I have performed these tests(viscosity & additive levels) in a lab in a 15 week long, fuels & lubricants course I once had. Not certain how you test the viscosity of oil in the field as viscosity is temperature sensitve & adjustments need to be made based on the ambient temperatures. When conducting viscosity tests and the equipment to test is a bit extensive and must be kept very clean.
Ive blown air filters out for years. At a dirty location swapped every pm. At a clean location blow it out 4 to 5 times then change. 30000 plus hrs on some machines with no engine failure. The transmission issue however is one that I can understand, my branch will not change it under contract and the customer dont want to pay for it. Resulting in 5 to 10 failures in the last 15 years. Oil is cheap compared to engines or transmissions change that stuff and have a piece of mind. Sorry for the rant got to go and not change some trans fluid today.
Why would anyone think it is good to blow out an air filter. They can be damaged and allow dirt to go thru them. Try not changing one and have a engine go bad the customer will blame the service provider. Only the customer can make the decision to blow it out but be sure it is on the work order or it could come back on you.
Well if you want engineers to do the job right you have to make it clear ,to the people who send them out to do the job, two things the first is that they will save money if they service the truck in the correct manner and the other thing is stop employing numptys and employ good engineers who actually want to do the job right and then allow them time to do the job.
My last employer was quite happy to send a painter out to service a truck with no knowledge other than how to change two filters oil filter and air filter and then they didn`t even give him the right engine oil. they were happy because he had turned up and fullfilled his contract of three services a year and the employer did it as cheap as possible.every body wins until two or three years down the line the truck stops the customer gets a big bill then next time it comes to buy more trucks you hear" them trucks are crap cost me a fortune" and they move on to the next manufactuer for another five years.
There are plenty of post here without any sort of malice, (imho).
I have to agree that most customers are as clueless as dirt when it comes to their forklifts, (after all, ain't that why they hire "experts").
I would also have to agree that I have seen customers that had the very best level of service, and decide that they were going to change service companies, just because they didn't know how good they had it.
I have often noted that a service tech can steal far more with an ink pen than crowbar.
Now, as far as "were the defects resolved". I would not instantly blame the tech for that one, there are often times the company's procedures are the cause of repeat problems, and even the best tech sometimes can not stop operators from driving a cushion tire truck, with no side-shift, on rough asphalt, and wearing out the steer tires in 500 hours, or keep the product from being spilled on the electronics (or was noted in another thread here, keep the salt or blood from gumming up the works.
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