For all the great results of gps,Did you use it as your only tool to watch over techs.When you get right down to it if your the service manager your job is to watch techs and to ensure they are doing what they say they are.Not the only part but an important one.I just hate for anyone to think its the magic bandaid.

Response to mcracing :"Thank you for your honesty, I wish every
Manager could read your post, They could learn from it!"

You are one of the "very " few that feels that way and your post has renewed my hope, Maybe someday they will all get it!

WOW, mcracing summed up the entire discussion in one post.

GPS is a valuable tool if used correctly. You will have some problems upon implementation but in the long run it will pay off and techs who do what they are suppossed to be doing can practically ignore the GPS all together. Customer retention and customer service are key and any tool that helps with these two important factors of a service business is no longer an option but absolutely essential equipment.

I believe mcracing is genuine because of what he said about being a sales person. I was in outside sales for new trucks for some time and I can say this: Any sales person who is pulling their weight is not working 6 or 7 hours a day, they are working long hard hours, 10 or 12 hours sometimes. And remember, this is for commission, not hourly pay, no overtime and you need to "cold call" constantly. You will definately gain new respect for sales people once you actually do the job, but that being said there is no better pay off than selling a new truck to a new customer and beating out 4 or 5 competitors and you weren't the low price.

This has been a great, informative discussion with loads of great posts so far.

mcracing,
if what you say is true you are the exception for sure.

I have found this a very interesting topic. From my perspective and 33 years in the industry you have all very valid points to consider.
One of the posts said that they have never heard of a GM coming from a service background.
Here is a little of my history.
13 years as a road mechanic. I started in a grease truck and eventually was one of those premadona road toads who wanted to work 4 hours, billed 8 to 10 for the company and thought I should be allowed to go home at noon. My customers loved me right. Never a complaint about a bill! What's the problem.
Spent one year as an aftermarket salesman, during that year I realized what it was like to have to be the one to go and see the customer when he didn't need anything; suddenly I was no longer the hero. During this year I gained new respect for what sales people go through.
After complaining enough about a bad service manager at the company I was asked if I could do it better. Not thinking before I spoke the next thing I knew that was my new title. Service Manager. I did that job for 8 years at two different companies.
One day I got a call from the factory and next thing I knew I was the regional manager for 26 states.
Next a Branch Manager for 10 years and very recently I accepted the title of GM
240 employee's and over 100 road mechanics in vans.
I have seen many things come and go in the service side of our business over the years but the topic of abusing time is still an issue that drives management crazy.
Here are a few thoughts I have.
Do I have GPS- Yes on every van, transport truck and parts trucks. For over three years now
Do I save on fuel- Yes over 18% reduction since implementation.
Do I save on insurance- Yes 10% annually.
Is it a tool- yes
Is it used to provide customer service- yes
Does it control speeding- yes
Has it improved our response time- Yes
Is it used for anything else- Yes, We use it to receive time cards, parts tickets and bill directly from the information.
Did we have push back - Yes
Did we lose mechanics because of it - Yes
Was it bypassed- Yes
Have I ever terminated or disciplined from its information - yes
Have we improved on productivity - Yes
Have we used it to defend a mechanic who had it reported that he was not at the customers for as long as he said - Yes
Have we used it to credit a customer when it was reported that a mechanic was not there as long as he was billed - Yes
Have we been able to keep rates down because of its use -Yes
Do we use it daily to check up on mechanics - No
Do we use it as a primary tool to discipline - No
The main point I wanted to make is that GPS can be used for good things. The customer is the real beneficiary when it is used correctly.
I understand how it can be seen as a BIG BROTHER and used to make up for management deficiancies.
I look at it this way
If I have to take off a 3/8 nut and have two wrenches in my hand, One a 9/16 boxed end and the other a crescent wrench. Both will do the job but one has higher risk than the other of causing damage to the nut.
What one would you chose.

Don't ever forget your roots if you do move up, and don't ever try to understand the problems of a job you have no experience at. Communication is the key to the best customer service. Keep that open and you will always sleep good at night.

I respect everyone in our industry and have never forgot that the mechanics our our front line.

RESPONSE TO: batman,

"Good point, batman, I can see where your coming from."

and I think you hit the nail on the head,,, it really does boil down to "roi".
If it is a -real world- return on investment, then everyone is all for it, but if it is an investment in a power trip for a foolish manager, then no one wants to give up that money...

Well, roadrat, here's what I think:

Some of the larger forklift service company's can have 100 or more road techs. Think about that for a while. Out of the 100 how many fit into the great tech category, the average tech category and the poor tech category. Now, by poor tech I don't necessarily mean that they can't fix something but that they dog the system for as much as they can. Let's say 30% (probably a conservative estimate) fit into the poor tech category and you have 40 techs. That means out of 40 techs you have 12 bad ones, each costing the company an average of 3 hours per day due to overbilled travel, rental, PM's, rework, etc. That's 36 hours per day x 5 days per week x 52 weeks = about 9,360 hours per year x $45 internal rate = $421,200.

Now, it is true you don't need GPS to single out these tech's, they are good at singling themselves out. So a company can fire every one of them (my favorite approach) and rehire 12 more guys, go through training and send the next 12 out. This could go on for months or years until you get a full crew of even average techs. In the mean time all the other techs are booking massive overtime, customer service is poor and the company is spending loads of money on training and other crap.

Or, you can just install GPS on everyone's van to keep the 12 slackers in line. I think this is the prevailing reason for GPS. It is the most cost effective and easiest way to keep your poor tech's doing what they are suppossed to do. I think it's a poor approach but it must work because GPS is becoming commonplace.

My approach would be to have a warning type system where tech's get a certain number of warning's, then days in the street, then fired. Your service department would have a revolving door but why bring great and average techs down to a mediocre level by showing them you don't trust them with GPS. Or, have a great service manager that can properly implement GPS and not **** off his good people, like that'll happen.

Our use 1 batt hot 1 ground 1 key start its on all the time.
It starts recording or sending when truck starts.I had to swap mine into new van

Proshade, really, it takes -3- jumpers, one for Batt neg, one for Batt Pos and one for "Key on" Pos.
But _I_ didn't ever tell anyone that...

"Well what "say ye" batman, it's your turn.

Gps wont give what it dont know if your smart enough to be a tech your smart emough to bypass it. 1 12 volt batt 2 jumper wires and your off to the races with gps sitting at spot you like.Gps can not be the only tool/method used.

Response to: Dave C----"You hit the nail on the head!"

"You described, in a few sentences, exactly where the problem is at"

GPS is just a tool like a wrench or a keyboard, controlled by people. When not properly managed by competent people will create problems. Sounds like alot of wreches & GPS users currently out there are lacking the training and/or skills to handle the job properly. Managers need to lead by example, after all there job as managers include being leaders, so all you managers out there should look at how you conduct your business, you are the leaders! How your organaztion operates is a reflection on how you operate.

Almost everyone that has posted knows of people they work with that are wasting time, speeding, using the van for things other than work. Did you need GPS to tell you these things? In todays world the GPS report will give a manager the hard proof to take the action neccessary to stop these things. It will also give you the hard proof to dispute them. It seems like we always see the down side to these things and no up side. It will allow you to have the proof that you were not speeding, reckless driving, all of the things you can get in trouble for can also be proved wrong. Much like any other tool it is just a tool that can be used or abused. In the end most of us don't own the van, the company, or the GPS unit that will be installed. The choice is not really ours to make so we need to take advantage of the technology and make the best of it.

Response to Dave C: You are right!
The problem goes back to management.

If you have 40 tech's "**** the sytem" you need more help than GPS!

I have intimate knowledge of both sides of the fence: management and tech because I have been both. The service and parts departments are THE money makers in any service business. New sales is happy to break even as is used sales and rental. However, rental is a different animal because the company is getting equipment at the end that is paid for by the customers.

So, let's say you own a forklift business and have a service department billing about 3 million per year. You should be making at least 1.5 million in profit. To bill this 3 million you have 40 road techs that you feel are **** the system for at least one hour per day per tech on average.

40 techs x 1 hour x 250 working days per year = 10,000 hours per year lost x $50 internal billing rate = $500,000 of increased PROFIT. Who in their right mind would NOT install GPS on service vehicles. Not to mention fuel savings due to decreased speed, no more weekend use of vans, etc., etc.

If this is your business with this scenario would really NOT install GPS?

I just started a new thread to discuss service managers, how many of them come from the service side? and are the ones from the service side any different?
I bet we would get a considerably different bunch of answers if we were on the MHEDA blog site for that thread....

The last service manager I had came from arrowhead water as a warehouse manager, big ? in 35 years I never seen a general thats came through the ranks as a tech, mostly they come from sales.