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lithium
  • J4ck
  • United Kingdom
There's a lot of money being spent on developing and promoting lithium, but the real world benefits aren't actually compelling right now. Very expensive tech, unknown long-term real life performance, excessive energy to manufacture and poor for recycling.
But it is moving forward and I'm sure these issues will be overcome with greater adoption.
But when do people think it will be a viable option for the majority of electric FLT's? Anyone willing to put a date on the tipping point?

Jack Little
(my opinions are my own (mostly!))
  • Posted 15 Feb 2019 01:13 AM
Total replies: 19. Showing items 1 - 19 of 19 results.
Replies
Nearly all OEM offer a full line of electric lifts with lithium ion currently and many have been for several years with great success. it is a rapidly growing demand from customers.
  • Posted 15 Feb 2019 05:09 AM
  • J4ck
  • United Kingdom
But we are still a long way from it over taking older tech. The volumes are still relatively small and customers have operational issues to overcome for full adoption.
When do you think we will be looking at a tipping point?
  • Posted 16 Feb 2019 06:39 PM
It's not a path anyone can predict. It might become absolete way before it gains significant traction. Look what happened to hydrogen fuel cells....

The only sure thing is death and taxes, and taxes outlives death.

Dreamt I was fixing a machine, then came the paperwork and it turned into a nightmare.
  • Posted 21 Feb 2019 11:57 PM
  • J4ck
  • United Kingdom
Just been discussing with a forklift service company, they are finding that lithium batteries are often failing before reaching their cycle life. Anyone else experiencing early failure of Lithium?

They couldnt give me a figure, so thought I would seee if anyone on here can provide a perspective.
  • Posted 17 Jun 2019 10:21 PM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Do You know have much it would cost to dispose of old lithium iron batteries, and what regulations have to be followed
  • Posted 25 Jun 2019 04:31 AM
  • lifter01
  • West Yorkshire, United Kingdom
For somebody from Yorkshire Dave your English isn’t very good
  • Posted 3 Jul 2019 08:46 AM
With the announcement of Menards (Major retailer in the USA) buying 600 lithium powered trucks, the reality is that lithium is here to stay. Likely more compelling than Fuel Cells at this point.
  • Posted 9 Aug 2019 02:45 AM
Not saying that lithium is not the future, but if I remember correctly, Exalt made the same argument when Wal Mart bought into hydrogen fuel cells.

Dreamt I was fixing a machine, then came the paperwork and it turned into a nightmare.
  • Posted 9 Aug 2019 07:38 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
The two biggest issues with Lithium are one cost compared to lead acid they are much more expensive, and secondly the risk of fire if they are over charged Lithium can charge from say 20% - 80% very quickly, but after 80% charged this is where the case of a fire is more likely.



Lithium iron batteries could have caused a major fire earlier this year in a major warehouse in the UK. It is said that lithium iron batteries in a robot over heated and caused the fire. This was harder to put out when the fire brigade got there because they could not put out the lithium iron batteries in the equipment.

Having said this there will be a lot of development in graphene supercapacitors over the next couple of years and these could have the ability to over take both Hydrogen fuel cells and Lithium iron

www.saudiexalt.com
  • Posted 11 Aug 2019 04:24 AM
  • • Modified 11 Aug 2019 04:25 AM by poster
  • lifter01
  • West Yorkshire, United Kingdom
Actually Dave according to the fire brigade report it was a faulty onboard charger that caused the fire at Ocado and talking to maintenance engineers I know who work on the site that’s what they are saying too.
By the way Dave where’s the super truck that said you were going to show the world in April?? It’s august now and still no sign
  • Posted 15 Aug 2019 07:58 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Well that’s plausible so the faulty on board charger fire caused the lithium iron battery to catch fire burning down the hole warehouse because the fire brigade could not bring the lithium iron battery fire under control.

www.saudiexalt.com
  • Posted 16 Aug 2019 04:39 AM
  • lifter01
  • West Yorkshire, United Kingdom
Both the robot and the manufacturer and Occado state that the fire was caused by an onboard charging unit setting fire to the plastic lid on the robot. No mention of a Li-Ion battery fire Dave. I take it your pointing out how dangerous Li-Ion is because your super truck uses different technology Dave??
  • Posted 16 Aug 2019 07:27 AM
  • swoop223
  • North Carolina, United States
well to keep on topic here
In my professional opinion:

lithium was never a good choice for battery options, they are dangerous period, lithium is unstable.
IMO the ONLY reason Li-Ion was developed is because of their ability to 'fast charge' and their power range curves being better than lead acid. Thats about it
Consumers wanted a battery they could charge fast to turn the lift operation around quicker and eliminate the handling of batteries by having to change a battery, not to mention the extra cost of buying extra batteries in the first place.
The trade off being the risk/danger of fires and also the fact their recycleability being poor and lets not forget they are expensive, the downsides that imo are not worth what you get.
As for the future of them? unless engineers come up with a better solution i'm sure they will continue to push down this shaky path trying other pointless updates while consumers still have to deal with the instablity of lithium and fire hazards associated with it.

You've been swooped!
swoop223@gmail.com
  • Posted 16 Aug 2019 11:10 PM
Bottom line after all innovation at the moment good ol lead acid with changing system is king. And IC engines still rule in automotive...

Dreamt I was fixing a machine, then came the paperwork and it turned into a nightmare.
  • Posted 17 Aug 2019 12:24 AM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
I agree with Yidneck lead Acid are better for electric forklifts at the moment, with possibly lead crystal or nickle zinc added some time in the future. The IC engine is better for trucks working out side and big trucks. Its proven cost effective and engineers know how to fix they if there ever is a problem.


The fire at Ocado cost the company around $137 Million that a lot of money for a onboard charger setting fire to a plastic lid

www.saudiexalt.com
  • Posted 17 Aug 2019 05:07 PM
  • • Modified 17 Aug 2019 05:13 PM by poster
From what i understand, lithium iron phosphate batteries which are being used by most manufactures now only give of steam when damaged.

Lithium ion is being driven by the automotive industry and there is many companies investing heavily in battery technology. Solid state batteries etc. Batteries are evolving very fast now.

Batteries are the future but in what variant?
  • Posted 23 Aug 2019 08:19 PM
Super capacitors?

Dreamt I was fixing a machine, then came the paperwork and it turned into a nightmare.
  • Posted 23 Aug 2019 09:41 PM
I think a combination of both is more likely.
  • Posted 23 Aug 2019 10:12 PM
  • exalt
  • Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Amazon bought Maxwell Supercapacitor,

www.saudiexalt.com
  • Posted 25 Aug 2019 05:33 PM
Total replies: 19. Showing items 1 - 19 of 19 results.

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